S2S Sisters: "The God Who Sees" by Natasha Sweazy

Our prayer is that you will be filled with the knowledge of His will, strengthened with all might according to His glorious power. Welcome to Strength to Strength Sisters. We're so glad each of you has joined us. The vision for Strength to Strength Sisters is to encourage women to be catalysts in advancing the Kingdom through biblical teaching, testimonies of faithful women, and thought-provoking discussions.

We're so glad you're all here. This is a call for sisters, and we invite you to participate. After the talk today, there will be a Q&A, and have questions ready. We have Natasha here who is going to be speaking to us, and we will open it up for either you to ask the questions via the chat button at the bottom of your screen, or you can also turn on your video and ask the questions as well. We love the participation that comes through this, so thank you for joining us. There will be recordings available through YouTube and also the podcast platforms. You can get more information on the strengthtostrength.org/sisters, and there's also a number of previous talks that are available there as well.

So today we are welcoming Natasha Swayze, and she is from Massachusetts currently, but they bounce back and forth between Kampala, Uganda, and Boston, Massachusetts. And her and her husband, Charlton, have been involved in ministry for many years. They have been married for 14 years. They have 10 children, four biologically and six through adoption, which came to them through Uganda.

Natasha is striving to follow after her King Jesus, and I have been tremendously blessed to know Natasha and to be friends with her. So we're looking forward to her talk today. She's going to be talking to us on the topic of the God who sees, and this is a very pertinent talk for today, I feel, because what she's touching on is the worldview of children. How do we view children from the worldview that we have today? How does our world around us view children, and how was it in Bible times?

We know that the Bible talks about women who said, "Give me children or I will die." And now today, it seems like the mantra coming from the world is, "Give me children and I will die." So no matter what stage we are in life, I think this talk will be for us. And how can we look at children in the way that God looks at children? So we're really looking forward to what Natasha has to say, and let's just pray for you, Natasha, before you get started.

Father in heaven, thank you for this chance to be together today. I pray that you would bless Natasha as she shares what you have laid on her heart. I pray that you would fill her with grace, with your truth, and with your words. I pray that you would show us your heart for children, your heart for the world around us. And Father, I just pray that you would bless Natasha in a special way, bless them as they raise their family for you and for your kingdom. Give them the strength and the power that they need and just fill them in a very special way.

Thank you, Father, for being our Abba Father, and we look to you for all of our needs. In Jesus' name, amen.

Amen. Okay, go ahead. All right, well, hello everybody. I'm really excited to be on Strength to Strength Sisters today. I think this is such an amazing platform, super encouraging, and yeah, thank you for having me.

Lynelle actually reached out to me and asked if I would be willing to do a talk about how children are a blessing and some encouragement for moms. I feel so tremendously honored to be asked to talk about something as important as children in motherhood, especially in our current cultural climate. But I have to confess before I get started that I do feel a bit unworthy doing this talk today about raising children, considering I've personally only been a mother for 11 years. But after some time in prayer, I realized that I can use up my life trying to prove my worth to others and waiting to arrive, or I can spend my life talking about how worthy He is.

And that's the point. He is so worthy, and I think that's why we're all here today. So I do want to start by giving glory and honor to God for the work that He is doing and is continuing to do in my life.

I want to share the scripture, Ephesians 3:20-21. Now, to Him who is able to do exceedingly, abundantly above all what we ask or think, according to the power that works in us, to Him be the glory in the church by Christ Jesus to all generations forever and ever. Amen.

He has exceedingly and abundantly done more in my life and in the lives of my brothers and sisters around me than I could have ever imagined. And so I would like to begin by sharing some of my story with you.

I was born in Killeen, Texas. My dad was a Chief Warrant Officer IV in the U.S. Army. That basically means he was a senior-level expert of both the technical and tactical aspects of leading in his field. And his field was aviation. He was a helicopter pilot, and that was his dream in his youth. He accomplished that dream.

He was a very driven, hardworking man. In the '80s, my dad was stationed in Germany, and that's where he met my mom, who is German, and my dad about 20 years his junior. They fell in love, and that's when she moved to Texas with him. Anyway, I imagine going from living this European lifestyle to moving to Texas, Killeen specifically, which is best known for its neighbor Fort Hood, I imagine that would be very difficult. And Fort Hood happens to be one of the largest military bases in the world. Not too long after I was born, we moved to Port Huron, Michigan, where we lived until I was in fifth grade, so about 10 years old.

Then we moved to Reno, Nevada, so more the West Coast. And in Reno is where I met my husband, Charlton. Now, Charlton and I met when I was 16, so we were definitely high school sweethearts. But that's a different story. I'm not going to get into that today, so we'll just move along. I'm one of three children. I have an older brother and a younger sister. We grew up going to a Lutheran church, and later when we moved to Nevada, we started attending an evangelical church. So that's a bit of my background. My dad always made sure we went to church even when we did not want to. And I have to admit, as a teenager, I really had moments where I did not want to go to church, but it was important to him.

Now, my mom was not a Christian when I grew up, so sometimes she came with us, sometimes she didn't. Sometimes she just stayed at home, and we went to church. And you know that's hard when you have a family divided like that. But my parents loved us. There was never any doubt in my mind about that. And I believe they were doing the best they could with what they had. But one thing they did not have was surrender to the Lordship of Jesus, and that changes everything.

My home life growing up was filled with dysfunction, and I hate to say, but as a child, I felt like a burden. I always felt bad for my dad. Technically, he could have been old enough to be my grandfather. And as a child, I would find myself sympathizing with him because he was so tired. There was constant strife and unrest in my home, arguing, screaming. My parents' fights could suck the oxygen out of a room.

The outbursts of anger left me feeling very unprotected, especially when my dad would leave, or rather flee. My mom was never taught what it means to be a wife, a mother, a homemaker. She was basically all alone in a new country with three little children.

After my dad died and I became a teenager, my mom and I would have full-blown battles. It was not peaceful in my home, to say the least. But now that I'm a Christian and a mother, I have so much compassion and love for my mom.

And I don't know if she ever really felt cherished. When I was young, she pursued her career, and education was very important to her. And that's how she was raised. Those were the ideals that my grandparents put in my mom. That's how many of us were raised.

My siblings and I spent a considerable amount of time in our growing-up years with babysitters and alone at our house. I wanted to share a little bit of my growing-up years with you ladies just to paint a small picture of how many people in my generation, from my background as millennials, how we've grown up. And this is not unique to my situation.

Many of us were parked in front of cable television all afternoon without checks or balances or supervision, and we didn't really have a place of belonging in our families. Now, granted, that's not every situation, but it's the one I identify with.

So we looked for belonging and self-worth in other places: relationships, sports, music, partying, working. When someone grows up feeling like a burden, why would they find value? Or rather, how could they find value in the family structure or children? It's helpful for me to check the dictionary for the meaning of words. I looked up the word burden in order to really understand the word and see if the words used to define the term have special significance for an understanding of a specific problem. In the case of burden, the dictionary's definition is something that is carried, something that is emotionally difficult to bear, a source of great worry or stress. It ends with various synonyms of burden, such as affliction, cross, trial.

And notes, these nouns denote something onerous or troublesome.

According to the Population's Revenue Bureau, American women averaged more than seven children each until the early decades of the 19th century. After 1900, average fertility declined gradually, interrupted only by the baby boom following World War II. Another drop in the total fertility rate came in the 1970s due in large part to delayed marriage, widespread contraceptive use, and changes in abortion laws.

The total fertility rate is the average number of children a woman would have in her lifetime based on the child-bearing rates of women in a population in a given year. So in 2020, the U.S. total fertility rate dropped to 1.64. That's a child and a half, the lowest level ever recorded.

Most millennials came of age and entered the workforce facing the height of an economic recession, states the report by Pew Research. Fully a third of older millennials have a four-year college degree or more, making them the best educated cohort of young adults in American history.

But they also carry the burden of student loan debt and lower wages historically than previous generations. Now, I'm not sharing this to villainize higher education. I think education can be used as an amazing tool to evaluate the world through a biblical lens and advance the kingdom of God in multiple ways.

The picture that I'm painting is building a major piece of the foundation for why our birth rates in view of children in the Western world have declined so drastically. Our experiences in childhood do have an enormous effect on our life as adults.

I came across an online article recently. It's called 11 Brutally Honest Reasons Millennials Don't Want Kids. I'd like to share the reasons from this article. I think it's very helpful to see and get a better understanding of the cultural climate in our society surrounding children. Now, for each reason that's given, there's a supporting quote that correlates to that reason that I will read.

All right, 11 brutally honest reasons. Number one, kids aren't always financially feasible, especially if you have student loans. It leaves your body and it costs 20,000 to 30,000. I have 40,000 in student loans already taking up the rest of my life. And that's the best-case scenario. If anything goes wrong, double it.

Number two, there's a strong fear of passing down mental health issues. I've struggled with depression, and if I pass that pain on, I would feel horrid for inflicting that sadness and numbing on another human. No one deserves to live like this if it can be prevented.

Number three, the population is already out of control. I joined the Zero Population Growth Movement a long time ago for environmental reasons. Number four, fertility issues can give a different perspective on the necessity of having kids. I can't have kids naturally. It's not a sad thing, though. A lot of other women get upset when I tell them that. But I just say I really have no right to complain about one gift I didn't receive when I had been given so many to begin with.

Number five, pregnancy can take a serious physical toll. The physical changes my body would go through with the pain of birth is not appealing to me at all. The idea of carrying a child makes me nauseous.

Number six, with kids come pressure to make perfect choices. It overwhelms me to think that there would be a tiny little person growing inside of me depending on me to make healthy choices. Number seven, not all women are pre-programmed with maternal instincts. Children always have irritated me to no end. The only time I enjoy children is when they are quiet, humble, intelligent beings. Obviously, these conditions are unreasonable to expect of the tiny humans. So for me, the logical solution is to not have any of my own.

Number eight, the world isn't always a nice place. I was bullied a lot as a child. I know what children are capable of, and it scares me. I see all children as a potential future threat simply because about 70% of people in my year group were bullies, and most of them still are. I wouldn't want a child to have to live in a world where they'll either be bullied or be the bully. I don't think I could handle seeing my child cry from being made fun of or being told my own child had made someone else cry for fun.

Number nine, sometimes career ambitions take priority. I have noted from quite a young age that when a man and a woman get married and have children, it almost always means the woman becomes a housewife, unless the parents both have to work. I have worked hard in school and would love to get married someday.

But the idea that I would quit my job that I have worked my whole life to stay home for the next 18-plus years does not appeal to me. Number ten, children don't fit into every lifestyle. With the way I want to live my life, kids would get in the way.

And our last is number 11. Ultimately, a reason shouldn't even be necessary. I don't want kids because I just don't. I shouldn't have to explain my reasoning or even have a reason at all. My body, my choice.

This thinking that I just shared with you, ladies, this view of children, it's not just an out-there issue. It's something that is as well infiltrating the church. It's something that I've seen that we were really striving to talk to women about and to work through these things.

So this is not just like a worldly problem. I find the timing of this talk to be providential because of the overturning of Roe v. Wade over the summer. So June 24th, the matter of abortion legalization was returned to individual states. So there is no longer a federal constitutional right to an abortion.

Now, there has been an uproar over this decision. I actually saw a picture in the news of a pregnant woman at a protest. She had her stomach exposed, and written on her pregnant stomach were the words, "This is not a human yet."

The women of old cried, the women of old cried, "Give me children or I die." And we see that the cry of the modern woman is, "Give me children and I'll die."

When I read through the Old Testament stories, I'm blown away. They are exciting, unusual. They're an adventure. The women from the Old Testament were brave and noble, but also at times very broken. God has valued women as part of his plan for salvation.

These wise women of old have taught us many things from their triumphs and failures. One thing for sure is that children are invaluable, and we see that all over Scripture. Children have value. I would like us to read Genesis 16 together, the story of Hagar and Sarai.

Actually, Bernice Troyer gave a talk in July titled, "Return to Thy Mistress." She shared great relational lessons from the experiences from Hagar and Sarai. So if you have not listened, I would definitely recommend it. I'll actually share a quote from her talk that really resonated with me. She said, "The idea that we should not have to suffer or sacrifice is weighing us down with so much baggage, like personal rights, expectations, control issues, and really just relationship problems."

Genesis 16 is very rich in multiple ways. The passion and the importance of children is really highlighted here as well. So I'll be reading from the New King James Version if you'd like to follow along.

Now, Sarai, Abraham's wife, had borne him no children, and she had an Egyptian maidservant whose name was Hagar. So Sarai said to Abram, "See now, the Lord has restrained me from bearing children. Please go into my maid. Perhaps I shall obtain children by her." And Abram heeded the voice of Sarai.

Then Sarai, Abram's wife, took Hagar, her maid, the Egyptian, and gave her to her husband, Abram, to be his wife. After Abram had dwelt 10 years in the land of Canaan, so he went into Hagar, and she conceived. And when she saw she had conceived, her mistress became despised in her eyes.

Then Sarai said to Abram, "My wrong be upon you. I gave my maid into your embrace. And when she saw that she had conceived, I became despised in her eyes. The Lord judge between you and me." So Abram said to Sarai, "Indeed, your maid is in your hand. Do to her as you please." And when Sarai dealt harshly with her, she fled from her presence.

Now, the angel of the Lord found her by a spring of water in the wilderness, by the spring on the way to Sur.

And he said, "Hagar, Sarai's maid, where have you come from?" The angel of the Lord said to her, "Return to your mistress and submit yourself under her hand."

Then the angel of the Lord said to her, "I will multiply your descendants exceedingly so that they shall not be counted for multitude." And the angel of the Lord said to her, "Behold, you are with child, and you shall bear a son. You shall call his name Ishmael because the Lord has heard your affliction. He shall be a wild man. His hand shall be against every man and every man's hand against him. And he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren." Then she called the name of the Lord who spoke to her, "You are the God who sees." For she said, "Have I also here seen him who sees me?"

Therefore, the well was called B'lahai R'ohai. Observe, it is between Kadesh and Bered. So Hagar bore Abram a son, and Abram named his son, who Hagar bore Ishmael. Abram was 86 years old when Hagar bore Ishmael to Abram.

So Sarai longed desperately for her own child, so much so she ended up making a decision that forever changed history. Yet God still chose her to be the mother of the nation of Israel. Hagar encounters hard times and learns an invaluable lesson that God is the God who sees.

He knows our situation, and he is in control and trustworthy. We need to release that control we feel like we need to have.

So my husband and I have been traveling between Kampala, Uganda, and Massachusetts. We're just right outside of Boston. And over the summer, we went back to Kampala. In 2015, we did a church plant there, and the church is doing great. It was really encouraging for us to spend several months there and be with the brethren. We just love them and miss them so much. But over the summer, some of us ladies decided to read a book together. And so the book that we decided to go through is The Women of the Bible Speak.

So I don't know if you can—this was just something really fun that we could do together. Some people, reading is more challenging, so we just get together on Fridays and read through a chapter and then do questions, thoughts. And yeah, it was really great.

I actually wanted to share a page from this book. She goes through all the women in the Bible and talks about them. And I want to share a little bit about what the situation with Hagar—and I really like what this author says here. So I'm going to go ahead and share this with you.

And this is on page 18. Anybody is curious. So this is the first appearance of the angel of the Lord in the Bible talking about Hagar when she's in the wilderness. And this mighty angel doesn't come to a king or to a priest, but to a pregnant slave girl who is alone and cowering in fear in the wilderness.

She had no defender or encourager in this world, and yet the God of heaven wanted Hagar to know that he saw and heard her in her distress. The angel tells her that the Lord has heard of your misery. This must have been astonishing news for more than one reason. For one thing, Hagar was not of Abraham's family. She was an Egyptian, not even from Abraham's home of Ur. She probably didn't even speak their language all that well. And there's a good chance she did not worship the strange and singular God that they worshiped.

Why would that God care about her? But he came to her in her fear, in her desolation. He saw her. So who was it Hagar saw exactly? After the angel of the Lord told her to go back to Sarah, he delivered a promise. He gave her a message using words that, for a Christian, echo the words spoken by another much later angel.

Genesis 16:11, "You are now pregnant, and you will give birth to a son. You shall name him Ishmael." But when the visitation was done, what did Hagar say? As far as she was concerned, she had a direct and unmediated vision of God himself.

She even gave God a name, the first person in the Bible to do so. And I find this to be incredible. She gave this name to the Lord who spoke to her, "You are the God who sees." For she said, "I have now seen the one who sees me."

She said that the one who appeared to her was El R'ohai, which means literally the God of seeing. God had seen her, and she had seen God. Hagar had been perfectly seen and known. Think about what that must have meant for an enslaved woman.

How many eyes had looked right past her or through her in her life? Visitors to Abraham's tent, people in the slave market of Egypt. She would have been no more than furniture to them, something people glanced at and then away from.

She was used to being unseen. But this God was not like that. God looked right at her. And for the first time in her life, Hagar was seen.

She was seen. She was recognized. God cared for her, a lowly servant girl. He was watching out for her well-being.

What an incredible truth that God loves his creation. When we read the Genesis narrative, we learn that God is an amazing and awesome creator. We also learn that he deeply cares about his creation and his creatures, and he shows love to them in the most remarkable ways. It's just so encouraging to me to know that no matter where we are, he is a God who sees us, who loves us, who wants us to know and trust him.

So I just hope that if any of you can take anything away from this talk today, it would be the knowledge and confidence that God sees you. You can trust him to love you and guide you through your journey, whatever your journey may be.

Maybe you're a woman who has been unable to have children, and the guilt-ridden pain you feel when yet another one of your friends gets pregnant crushes you. God sees you. Maybe you're a mama with multiple littles at home, and you're up to your ears in laundry, cleaning, food preparation, and you're just tired.

God sees you. Or maybe you're a mama whose adult child has rejected God, and you're heartbroken and you're discouraged. God sees you.

It does not matter what stage of life we are in. Our God sees us, and he knows the desires of our hearts. And our children are very important. Children are a blessing. They are worth fighting for. But we fight on our knees in prayer. We have to release that control we feel like we need to have over them.

When I think about blessing, I think of Jacob wrestling with God. Jacob's life was one of never-ending struggle. In fact, we can easily recognize our own elements of struggle in his story: fears, darkness, loneliness, vulnerabilities, exhaustion, relentless pain.

Blessing is not necessarily this happy, cheerfully unconcerned thing. Blessing is hard-earned, just like our children are hard-earned. In fact, it's in the story of Jacob where the famous words are written, "Give me children or else I die." That's in Genesis 30:1.

And that's when his wife Rachel saw that she bore Jacob no children. Now, I'd like us to read a little further in that story in chapter 32. So again, I'm reading from the New King James, Genesis 32.

So Jacob went on his way, and the angels of God met him. When Jacob saw them, he said, "This is God's camp." And he called the name of that place, Mahanaim. Then Jacob sent messengers before him to Esau, his brother, in the land of Seir, the country of Edom. And he commanded them, saying, "Speak thus to my lord, Esau.

Thus your servant Jacob says, 'I have dwelt with Laban and stayed there until now. I have oxen, donkeys, flocks, and male and female servants. And I have sent to tell my lord that I may find favor in your sight.'" Then the messengers returned to Jacob, saying, "We came to your brother Esau, and he also is coming to meet you with 400 men with him." So Jacob was greatly afraid and distressed, and he divided the people that were with him and the flocks and the herds and camels into two companies. And he said, "If Esau comes to the one company and attacks it, then the other company which is left will escape."

Then Jacob said, "O God of my father Abraham and God of my father Isaac, the Lord who said to me, 'Return to your country and to your family, and I will deal well with you.' I am not worthy of the least of all the mercies and of all the truth which you have shown your servant.

For I crossed over this Jordan with my staff, and now I have become two companies. Deliver me, I pray, from the hand of my brother, from the hand of Esau, for I fear him, lest he come and attack me and the mother with the children. For you said, 'I will surely treat you well and make your descendants as the sand of the sea, which cannot be numbered for multitude.'" So he lodged there that same night and took what came to his hand as a present for Esau, his brother: 200 female goats and 20 male goats, 200 ewes and 20 rams, 30 milk camels with their colts, 40 cows and 10 bulls, 20 female donkeys and 10 foals.

Then he delivered them to the hand of his servants. Every drove by itself and said to his servants, "Pass over before me and put some distance between successive droves." And he commanded the first one, saying, "When Esau my brother meets you and asks you, saying, 'To whom do you belong and where are you going? Whose are these in front of you?' then you shall say, 'They are your servant Jacob's. It is a present sent to my lord Esau. And behold, he also is behind us." So he commanded the second, the third, and all who followed the droves, saying, "In this manner, you shall speak to Esau when you find him. And also say, 'Behold, your servant Jacob is behind us.'

For he said, 'I will appease him with a present that goes before me. And afterward, I will see his face. Perhaps he will look at me.'" So the present went on over before him, but he himself lodged that night in the camp.

And he arose that night and took his two wives, his two female servants, and his 11 sons and crossed over the ford of Jabok. He took them, sent them over the brook, and sent over what he had. Then Jacob was left alone, and a man wrestled with him until the breaking of day.

Now, when he saw that he did not prevail against him, he touched the socket of his hip. And the socket of Jacob's hip was out of joint as he wrestled with him. And he said, "Let me go for the day breaks." But he said, "I will not let you go unless you bless me."

So he said to him, "What is your name?" He said, "Jacob." And he said, "Your name shall no longer be called Jacob, but Israel, for you have struggled with God and with men and have prevailed." Then Jacob asked, saying, "Tell me your name, I pray." And he said, "Why is it that you ask about my name?" And he blessed him there. So Jacob called the name of the place, Peniel, for I have seen God face to face and my life is preserved.

Just as he crossed over Peniel, the sun rose on him and he limped on his hip. Therefore, to this day, the children of Israel do not eat the muscle that shrank, which is on the hip socket, because he touched the socket of Jacob's hip in the muscle that shrank.

So in the end, Jacob does what we all must do. I feel like it was important to read that whole chapter, even though it's kind of long and all these goats and all these animals and yada yada. But we see he must have been exhausted. I mean, going through all of that, and then that night he wrestles with a man.

But in the end, he confronts his failures, his weaknesses, his sins, all the things that are hurting him. He faces God. He comes to the end of himself. And that's where my story really begins. I came to the end of myself. And in all honesty, that's kind of an ongoing process. So still working through that. But after Charlton and I were married for several years, we welcomed our first child into the world. That year, God revealed himself to us in miraculous ways. We started studying the Bible with new eyes.

We began really learning about Jesus's teachings on the kingdom of God. There were discrepancies between what Jesus said and meant and how we actually lived and reinterpreted his words to fit our way of life.

But all of that changed, and we started to hunger and thirst after righteousness. That hunger and thirst resulted in my adult baptism in 2013 and then our move to East Africa in 2014. Since then, the Lord has blessed us with a total of 10 children, four biological and six through adoption.

I have so many amazing stories about our children and how God has shown up again and again. I feel like in my family, for me to even have multiple children has been a struggle for my mom, for my siblings.

I remember close to my wedding day, my mom told me, "Be careful you don't get pregnant right away. You need to take time and enjoy life." After Ava was born and we found out we were pregnant with our second son, our second child, our son named Boaz, we were actually we started to make a lot of changes at that point, and doors were opening for East Africa.

And then I became pregnant again with our third child. And my mom really strongly suggested I get on some contraceptives. And she was so worried. She was so genuinely afraid for me to have a child in East Africa.

And it really breaks my heart because that's not unusual for many people. That's the norm, and it shouldn't be. And I want to show my family, I want to show my friends, my community that children are special. They are a blessing.

And some days, it's very, very hard, but they are a blessing. And you should see the looks we get walking through the airport with 10 children. Whoo! It's something. In fact, I have a little story to share. We just came back from Kampala, and we arrived in Washington, DC. So we left at like 11 o'clock at night, all the children in tow, and did a switch planes in Belgium, went on to Washington, about eight hours each flight. And we went to customs in Washington. And the looks that people gave us, it's comical. If I wasn't so tired, I probably wouldn't have been laughing.

One of the customs officers looked at my husband, and he was like, "Are all these yours?" My husband's like, "Yeah." And he's like, "Man, you're my hero." And we just started laughing. And Americans, we're very forthcoming with our information. When you go to Europe, people are much more reserved. They don't quite share so freely.

But this customs officer then goes on to tell us, he's like, "You know, I have two children. After my second, I told my wife I wanted another. And she said, 'No.'" And that just made me feel so sad.

So, so sad that the desire of this man's heart was to have a bigger family, but his wife told him, "No."

Well, sticking with the theme of the God who sees, I do have a story to share about a time that I really, really felt seen, that I knew my children were seen.

So five out of the six of our adopted children are a sibling group. So they share the same mom and dad. And they grew up in Masesse, Uganda, which is a slum just outside of Jinja. Carol is our oldest. She is 18 now, but at the time—oh, this was years ago, three or four years ago—we went out to lunch. We tried to find some time to sneak away her and I and just really connect and go out to lunch. It's really great quality time. But this particular day, we went to a restaurant in Kampala, and Carol kept looking behind her at this group of young girls. And she's like, "Mama, I know those girls." And I'm like, "Wow, you do?"

And she said, "Yeah. I lived in Masesse with them. I recognize them from Masesse." And I was like, "Wow, that's incredible. We should go over and say hi." And she's like, "Oh, no, no, no, no." She's really shy. I'm much more extroverted than she is, so I have no trouble just walking up to a table and saying hello. But she's much more reserved, and she's like, "No, no, no." And I was like, "Oh, come on. Let's go say hi." So we walked over, and there was a muzungu with them. Now, muzungu means white person in East Africa. So if you're walking down the street, it's not unusual, in Uganda, to hear somebody say, "Muzungu, muzungu."

So there was a lady sitting there with this group of teenage girls. And I was like, "Hey, I wanted to come over and say hello. My daughter, Carol, recognized some of your girls from Masesse." Now, this woman who was sitting there, her name is Katie Davis Major. And I don't know if any of you have heard of the book, Kisses from Katie.

It is a book about a young woman who moves to Uganda and ends up adopting many children. It's a very interesting story, very good. And so this is who we started talking to. And she gets out of her seat, and she says, "Are you Toti's daughter?" And Toti is Carol's mom's name. And Carol's mom passed away. So she is no longer here.

And Carol said, "Yeah." And she's like, "Carol." And she started crying. And she ran over and gave her a hug. And she's like, "Where are your siblings? Where is everybody?" The last time Katie had seen Carol and her siblings was at their mother's funeral.

And that's actually one of my youngest girls. Her name is Katie after Katie Davis Major. That's who her mom had named her after because they were friends.

Their mom, Toti, actually part of how she worked to support her family was making beads for necklaces and bracelets. I don't know if you've seen any of those. But that's what she did to kind of support herself. And she did Bible studies with Katie.

And Katie's like, "So where are the rest of your siblings?" And I was like, "Oh, they're at home." She's like, "Well, what do you mean they're at home?" And I said, "Well, we're in the process of adopting them." And she said, "You have all of them?" And I was like, "Yeah."

And she said, "I have been praying for them. I have been praying that God would send them a family, that a door would be opened for them. And you have all of them." And it was such an incredible moment in my life to know that there is a God who hears our prayers, who sees us. He sees our children.

And he uses you and me to be his hands and feet in this world. And man, it is such a joy and incredible opportunity for us. The fact that he saw the desire of Katie's heart, he saw the desire of our hearts to open our home to children. And he honored that. There is actually a picture in this book of my children's mom.

I'll show it to you real quick. I don't know if you'll be able to see it.

But she is right here making beads. And it was after our meeting with her that we looked through this book. We got the book, looked through it, and found that picture. And what a gift that is to have a picture of their mom.

We all have stories. I'm sure many of us could tell stories, incredible stories about how God has seen us and how we've been blessed through our children. But in closing out today's talk, I want to share one more story with you.

And I think it will be an encouragement to all of you. I have a dear sister that is currently sojourning in Kampala. Her name is Faith Ann Horning. And Faith is really special. I have grown to love her dearly over the years.

Faith and her husband, Jeremy, have had extremely difficult pregnancies. And by the grace of God, they have been able to have three children. Their youngest child is 12 years old now. And I know that my sister had to mourn the reality that she may never again be able to hold a baby of her own.

Well, since they have been in Uganda, a door has opened for their family to foster a little boy. And as we were going through our book, Women of the Bible Speak, something really profound stood out to Faith. Rachel, who was married to Jacob, had trouble conceiving. So she took matters into her own hands.

And Rachel offered her servant over to Jacob in her place. So it's pretty much the same deal that Sarah offered to Abraham. So Genesis 35 through 6 says, "And Bilhah conceived and bore Jacob a son. Then Rachel said, 'God has judged my case, and he has also heard my voice and given me a son.' Therefore, she called his name Dan."

Do you want to guess what Faith's foster son's name is?

It's Dan. It's Danny. God is my judge. That was so significant to her to have this little boy come into her home and all of the heartache that her and her husband have gone through. And then God has so graciously given them this time with Dan.

They hope to adopt him. Maybe we can all put that on our prayer list for the hornings in Uganda that things would go through with her son. But he really is a God who sees.

And that's the conclusion of today's talk.

Thank you very much for that, Natasha. It's very touching. And yeah, I think that there's areas in my heart even where there's some selfish desires there where I don't want to see children the way that God wants to see them.

And may God change that in my heart. Yeah. So now is the time for the question and answer. What questions do you have? You can either turn your video on and ask the question, or you can go down to the bottom of your screen and hit the chat button. And you can put it in that way, and one of the admins will voice the question for you.

What questions do you have?

One of the questions that just came in on the chat is, "Are there any unique or specific challenges in raising adopted children?"

I think that's a great question.

That's a great question.

I think it's different for everybody. Every child, every adoption, every situation is different, backgrounds, everything.

I think one thing—well, there's a few things that come to mind that are unique. There's so much joy with adoption, but then there's so much pain. Sitting with your child late at night as they're mourning over their parent who is no longer here, trying to fill a set of shoes that you know you can never quite fill.

I think that's a very unique challenge to adoption. There's so much trauma to work through.

There's so many amazing rewards as well.

It's really by the grace of God we have united beautifully as a family. I cannot imagine what my life would be like without all my children. We are just molded together. God supernaturally has molded us together. I'm just so thankful for that. But I think there are a lot of unique challenges just dealing with the hurt, things that you weren't there for. They've experienced another life that you don't know. You can't begin to imagine. But you're there trying to help pick up the pieces.

It can be very hard, but also really rewarding, so.

Another question that came in on the chat says, "Do you struggle loving your adopted children and your children equally?"

Yeah, that's a very good question as well.

Love is something that we do. I see love as an action.

We choose to love people. We choose to walk with people. We choose that. And I choose to love all of my children. And I don't struggle with loving them equally. I love them all so much it hurts. But my relationship with each of them is different because every child is different, personalities and preferences. So our relationships all look a little bit different. But I do not struggle with loving them any less. Thank you for that question.

If you think about it, even loving your children, we think, "Okay, the reason we love our children may be because they're our children, right? We've grown them in our womb." But a lot of the love, too, can be just common experiences, time spent together. And I think those things create love.

Your relationship, you're giving, you're taking, the hard times, the good when you're together and all that, that makes strong relationships. And I can understand, even though I've never experienced adoption, that you would love them the same in a lot of ways, even though they didn't come the same way.

But I think, too, it's that this is a child made in the image of God. And if God sees us fit, who am I? Who am I to withhold what I have?

It's really praise God. I just praise the Lord for the work He's done in my life and my heart and how that can overflow, too, not just my own children, but other children, neighborhood children, children who we see begging on the streets when we're in Kampala. I mean, it's very easy even there when you have so much need and poverty. Children in the developing world can be treated like animals, worse than dogs, just begging. And you can fall into one ditch or the other. I think you can fall into just being so overcome with emotion that it's hard to even function.