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Jumpstarter 9 of 10

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The Myth of Christian America  /  MCA (13 of 14): Faith of the Founding Fathers #3  /  Discussion Questions
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Question 9
Bercot remarks, “I agree with Madison about the need to separate these two kingdoms… but he and I are at opposite spectrums,” and adds that governments “should at least recognize God as the ruler of the universe”; what does God actually intend for the relationship between earthly governments and His church, and where might Christians today be seeking a recognition that sounds spiritual but functions as control or validation?
Another way to ask: Bercot agrees with separating church and state but still thinks governments should recognize God. What does God want the relationship to be between governments and the church, and when might Christians be seeking “recognition” that is really about control or approval?

Direct Answer According to Bercot, Jesus intends His church to remain distinct from earthly governments (“two kingdoms”), influencing society as “light and salt” without state establishment; seeking government “recognition” can become a way to gain validation or control rather than trusting Christ’s design.

Support from Transcript:

  • Bercot says, “I agree with Madison about the need to separate these two kingdoms,” grounding it in Jesus: “that is how Jesus established His church.”
  • He clarifies the church can bless society, but that is not its main purpose: Christians are “the light and the salt of the world,” and their influence happens without establishment.
  • He differs from Madison because Madison wanted religion “totally out of everything,” including references to God.
  • Bercot says a government “should at least recognize God as the ruler of the universe” and that its power “comes from God,” which he doubts Madison believed.
  • He connects Madison’s approach to modern outcomes: Supreme Court decisions “ban religion and reference to God” from education and government.
  • He warns founders’ priorities often placed country above faith, suggesting political recognition can compete with allegiance to Jesus.
Discussion Follow-ups What is the difference between a church influencing society through holy living versus demanding state endorsement? How do we test whether we want “recognition of God” for God’s honor or for our political comfort?

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