Discussion Jumpstarter
Study leader reference - not a definitive answer
Question 4
When Drew recounts Wagner’s Seven Mountain teaching and the comment that a pop singer could “use her sexuality to glorify Jesus,” what does this reveal about the movement’s view of holiness, witness, and the relationship between worldly platforms and Christ’s kingdom—and how would early Christians have heard that claim?
Another way to ask: They describe the Seven Mountain teaching and the idea that a pop singer could use her sexuality to “glorify Jesus.” What does that say about their view of holiness and using worldly fame for God, and how might early Christians have reacted?
Discussion Jumpstarter
Direct Answer
Based on the speaker’s teaching, it reveals a willingness to leverage worldly platforms and methods—including sexualized appeal—as tools for “kingdom” influence, even when that conflicts with biblical holiness and kingdom values. Drew implies early-Christian, kingdom-shaped instincts would find that claim deeply out of step with Scripture and the church’s witness.
- Drew: Wagner pushed “infiltrate the systems of power… politics… arts… finances… and just kind of take them over for Jesus.”
- Drew recounts Wagner praising a Singapore pastor/pop singer: “she can use her sexuality to glorify Jesus,” and he became “so graphic” the translator was “blushing.”
- Drew’s response: “I think the Thai church needs a revival, but I don't think that's what they're actually selling.”
- Joel later frames the Seven Mountains approach as trading kingdom values for worldly ones (“take them over”).
- Drew contrasts with Jesus’ “upside-down economy” and warns against substituting “earthly power and economic influence” for spiritual fruit.