Discussion Jumpstarter
Study leader reference - not a definitive answer
Question 3
The speaker describes four unhealthy models of growth (“we’ll always have these sins,” “conversion removes problems,” “it’s all God’s job,” “it’s all our job”) and how the “it’s all God’s responsibility” model pushed him toward thinking “either God didn’t exist” or “predestination… I’m predestined to damnation”—which of those models have subtly shaped your instincts, and what spiritual/emotional fruit have you seen from them?
Another way to ask: Which unhealthy view of growth have you leaned toward ("we’ll always have these sins," "conversion fixes everything," "it’s all God’s job," or "it’s all our job")? What has that view produced in your emotions and spiritual life?
Discussion Jumpstarter
Direct Answer
The transcript suggests these unhealthy models produce confusion, repeated defeat, and even despair, because they either deny real change, promise instant change, or misplace responsibility. The speaker’s own fruit from the “all God’s job” model was discouragement so deep it pushed him toward doubting God or assuming predestined doom.
- Model 1 (“we’ll always have these sins”): people “confessed the same thing over and over… for years. They never conquered it,” which troubled him.
- He couldn’t reconcile ongoing sin with Jesus’ warnings: “If these are part of your life, you’re not going to inherit the kingdom of God.”
- Model 2 (“conversion removes problems”): “That was not my experience… it caused me to question whether I was a Christian or not.”
- Model 3 (“all God’s responsibility”): he tried praying, fasting, extreme measures—“I tried all that, and nothing improved.”
- Emotional outcome: he concluded “either there isn’t a God… or else predestination is a thing, and I’m predestined to damnation.”